How We Approach On-Page Optimization

Jun 18, 2024

Patrick Carver

Hi, I’m Patrick Carver / CEO, Constellation Marketing

I hope you enjoy listening to this podcast.
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Main takeaways:

  1. Understanding On-Page Optimization: Patrick discusses the importance of ongoing on-page SEO optimization to achieve top search positions.
  2. Effective SEO Tools: The key tools mentioned are SEMrush, Ahrefs, SEO Meta in 1 Click, and Surfer for comprehensive SEO analysis.
  3. Iterative SEO Process: Emphasizes the need for continuous iteration and analysis to adapt to Google’s algorithm changes.

Timestamps:

Introduction to On-Page Optimization and Its Importance

Timestamp: 00:00:03 – 00:01:21

Key SEO Tools for Effective Optimization

Timestamp: 00:01:21 – 00:03:33

Analyzing and Improving SEO Performance

Timestamp: 00:03:33 – 00:07:12

Adapting to Algorithm Changes and Focused Keywords

Timestamp: 00:07:12 – 00:09:20

Long-Term SEO Strategies and Final Advice

Timestamp: 00:09:20 – 00:28:05

Transcription:

00:00:03:14 – 00:00:50:00

Patrick Carver

I talked with Constellation Marketing, and today we’re going to talk about it’s really in the weeds, hands on SEO training. We’re going to be covering the topic of how we approach on page optimization. We really feel this is a crucial part of any SEO program. It’s one of the three pillars of our SEO program that we deliver for clients, and it’s really all about this monthly, even more than monthly ongoing process of constant iteration of us looking at the rest of the search results, looking at our clients search results, and figuring out what we can do to ultimately get them into those top level positions, which is really where you’re going to make the money

 

00:00:50:03 – 00:01:21:25

Patrick Carver

because you’re going to get more leads, more clients if you’re in those. So let’s get to it. We’re going to talk about this in three phases, really. The first one as maybe the most important next to the second of execution and then just some some other kind of bits and pieces that I think will help you understand optimization and some of the things to avoid, some of the things to keep in mind when doing it for analysis, we typically focus on using three tools.

 

00:01:21:25 – 00:01:51:04

Patrick Carver

We can use others, but I’m going to keep this whole chat to a bit of an abbreviated version because when you get into something like this, you can get down really into a wormhole because at the bottom of it is, is Google’s algorithm. Right? And so everything we do is attempting to maneuver around that algorithm and figure out what exactly it’s doing, how they’re waiting, different elements and different factors and signals that go into it.

 

00:01:51:04 – 00:02:13:24

Patrick Carver

So you can really go off in a really big, deep dive into this whole topic. But I’m going to kind of keep it surface level so that hopefully everybody can follow along. And it’s, you know, it serves as a practical tool, right? A practical way that you can get in and and help your own website. So we start with these three tools.

 

00:02:13:24 – 00:02:34:29

Patrick Carver

Typically, we use a you we believe is the best tool in the market. You can use SVM, Rush mas, other ones are okay. Those are really the top big three that are going to give you kind of the most holistic analysis. We also use a free tool called SEO Meta one click. There’s a Chrome extension free to get in the Google Chrome Store.

 

00:02:35:02 – 00:02:56:17

Patrick Carver

Very useful and I’ll cover that during this as well. And then we use Surfer. Another tool out there is Neuron Rider. You can actually pick up neuron Rider as a free Latrobe, not a free but a lifetime deal on app sumo. So if you Google app Sumo and go in there you’ll find neuron rider and I’ll go into kind of how we use these very briefly.

 

00:02:56:17 – 00:03:33:26

Patrick Carver

So this is going to be your kind of all in one CO2. And we use this to understand keyword track keywords, track performance of keywords, track performance of, of our client websites. And so that’s really where a lot of this will start. We’ll see big drops or big elevations with specific keyword positions. And then that’s when we kind of go into the second phase of actually trying to understand what we can do to improve it or what what is what has happened to where our page is no longer in the results that we want in those positions that we want, or maybe we’re just aspiring to be in those positions.

 

00:03:33:26 – 00:03:54:05

Patrick Carver

We haven’t obtained them yet. These to the meter, one click and the surfer or neuron. Right. Are going to be, in my opinion, the most impactful, assuming that one click and you probably can’t see it on on my screen, but it’s a it’s a Chrome extension. And what it’s going to do is, is just do a quick check of the meta information.

 

00:03:54:05 – 00:04:16:27

Patrick Carver

So we’re talking about title A description and then some other things like the header structure. So if the as you look at the headers on the page, so these are like the section titles, are these topical, right? And so let’s just go through kind of a practical example. If we were trying to rank for immigration attorney San Diego.

 

00:04:17:00 – 00:04:37:00

Patrick Carver

So when you hit that page, your page Googlebot indexes are going to look at that and try to understand what that page is all about. And their first tactic is to go look at it really at the code level or the metal level. And that’s where they’re going to see the title, the matter description they’re going to see in the code.

 

00:04:37:03 – 00:04:57:10

Patrick Carver

These these tags like each to reach three and so on. Those those are typically used for the section titles and seeing all of that together is going to give Google a really good idea about the content on that page. And so that’s really the first kind of basic thing you want to do. And I’ll talk about it even more here in just a second with the low talk about the low hanging fruit.

 

00:04:57:10 – 00:05:21:02

Patrick Carver

That’s really where we are just doing a quick kind of top of top of minor top level analysis through SEO matter one click. We’re also going to look at images. We can look at links in there, and it’s just a really nice tool to get a quick analysis of like, is there any are there any low hanging fruit items that we can go and tackle just to make sure we’re doing best practices?

 

00:05:21:04 – 00:05:48:21

Patrick Carver

Then you get into Surfer, which is going to be more complex and this is a relatively new tool. It’s probably about five years old and it kind of has taken the SEO world by storm because it operates on this, this fundamental idea that you should be assessing yourself against the other results that are in the first page. And so we use that to look at word count, keyword frequencies, page speed, different different other text elements.

 

00:05:48:23 – 00:06:10:24

Patrick Carver

Formatting lots of lots of stuff can go go in there. And it’s a it’s a really powerful tool as well that can be really useful. So when we have our tools, we want to kind of get into a specific or repeatable process to analyze these pages and make sure that they are fitting what we view as best practice.

 

00:06:10:24 – 00:06:32:12

Patrick Carver

And then we start to do the, the more challenging part, which is understand how our website or our page how it’s performing in relation to really the, the other competitors out there, the people who are on the first page, the results are just have higher positions compared to what we have. So the first thing we’re going to do is does it meet best practices.

 

00:06:32:14 – 00:06:56:14

Patrick Carver

So for me that’s all about the SEO matter. One click where the best practices are, you know, things like having a good title that fits, that’s the right length and description of all of these kind of these little signals that make it really easy for Google’s crawlers to understand what your page is all about. And so if you don’t have those those kind of key things, that’s the first place to start, right?

 

00:06:56:14 – 00:07:12:00

Patrick Carver

Because right away when they hit your website, they’re not going to read it like a human or a computer and they’re going to read it like a computer. And so you’re looking for all of these individual pieces just to make sure that it is up to their standards. Right. And so they’ve documented the stuff of what they want to see.

 

00:07:12:00 – 00:07:39:18

Patrick Carver

And so those are signals that we know about. And so it’s it’s really easy to fix them. And so that’s typically where we start. Next. We’re going to look at what is the difference between our page in the first page results and we use what we call a hiding in plain sight mentality. And this is the idea here is basically that you don’t need to have this wild, wildly deep understanding of SEO.

 

00:07:39:18 – 00:08:04:15

Patrick Carver

If you understand this basic principle that the people who are that you should be looking at for for optimization recommendations and things like that are going to be the people who are above you in the surgeries. Also, because this is Google’s already telling you exactly what they want to see in the first page. And so you really don’t need to worry about these hundreds of of signals you really want to focus in on.

 

00:08:04:15 – 00:08:33:08

Patrick Carver

What are those core difference differences between you and the people who are ahead of you, have been ahead of you or are now ahead of you because of a recent change. Then once we kind of assess some of those components, we’re looking at is this a content problem or is this a link problem Since the beginning of Google, these these are the two elements that have really dominated the algorithm and the signals that make the most impact on on on pages.

 

00:08:33:10 – 00:08:58:10

Patrick Carver

So when you’re looking at the yourself versus the other people on the first page, you’re trying to assess, hey, is this a content problem? Maybe we don’t have enough words, we’re not talking about the right things, or is this a link problem where all the other pages on that first page are? You have tons of links there from really powerful thought of domains, and that’s what’s going to inform us on what we what we need to do.

 

00:08:58:10 – 00:09:20:16

Patrick Carver

And then that will take us into the strategy part of of the next steps of what we wanted then action. Now, the final part that I want to talk about is is our IT well to two parts. One algorithm changes, right? The sometimes you are going to get drops or you’re going to get lifts just based on algorithm changes.

 

00:09:20:16 – 00:09:41:09

Patrick Carver

And Google does these every day, but they do big ones a couple of times a year by product, four or five. Sometimes it’s more frequent than that. And so when they do this, I always kind of liken it to like reshuffling the deck, right? And so maybe you were a top card for a while. They reshuffle it and you’re now on the second page.

 

00:09:41:12 – 00:10:05:29

Patrick Carver

So we’re also trying to understand if if that’s to blame or is it something that the competition’s done? Have they done something to elevate themselves? They got more links, they improve their content. Is the field getting better or was this just a a shakeup based on Google’s algorithm? Those are all things we were kind of weighing and then getting into what what are the next steps?

 

00:10:05:29 – 00:10:31:25

Patrick Carver

Are the actionable steps right now, the final part of our analyzation analysis process here is that we want to know whether or not these are focused keywords that we’re we’re we’re looking at, which were also target keywords and or supporting keywords. So the difference with these is that our target keywords are going to be ones for us include attorney, lawyer, abogado.

 

00:10:31:27 – 00:10:53:21

Patrick Carver

These are what we consider like money keywords, right? And we consider them that because of the high intent associated with them as opposed to someone searching for a more educational piece of information. Both are important, but really we want to give an outsized portion of our attention to these focused keywords. And so think about it from the consumer perspective, right?

 

00:10:53:21 – 00:11:21:12

Patrick Carver

If you were going on searching for immigration lawyer San Diego, you’ve already kind of made up your mind, or at least you’re you’re close to that point where you you either want a lawyer really thinking about getting a lawyer as opposed to someone searching USCIS office, San Diego. Both can be valuable and and you can provide information. But ultimately, we want to give an outsized portion of our analysis and our attention to those focused keywords.

 

00:11:21:14 – 00:11:40:18

Patrick Carver

So I’ve kind of got through all this in bits and pieces, but just to kind of bring it all together, we would take a process like this where we’re going to first go with low hanging fruit, then we’re going to look at the algorithm changes and try to figure out is it is it the entire website? Is it just one page?

 

00:11:40:20 – 00:12:10:15

Patrick Carver

Then we’re going to move on to links. Do we have an appropriate number of links compared to the other? First page results? Do we have enough internal links? Are we linking to that and supporting it from other pages on our website? And then I move down into the yellow portion and it’s a little more challenging because this is then usually when you have to kind of bring in a dev to work on the website because the, the optimization, the speed optimization components are a little more challenging, a little more technical.

 

00:12:10:15 – 00:12:33:05

Patrick Carver

And so that’s why we’ve we’ve kind of changed the color there just to show it’s a little bit more challenging to do that. You may need other resources. And finally, what I would consider really the most difficult part of the optimization process is getting into the the the writing, right? So we’re looking at do we need to adjust the word count?

 

00:12:33:05 – 00:12:57:08

Patrick Carver

Is our word count lower? Is it way higher than other pages on the first page? And then we want to think about, okay, do we do we have some sort of deficiency in terms of keywords or entities or are we not talking about certain things that Google sees in their knowledge graph as being important to this topic? And you have to be there if we want to be elevated into those first page results.

 

00:12:57:10 – 00:13:23:21

Patrick Carver

And then finally we can talk about supporting content, which is going to be other pages that we create too support that page that we are trying to rank. And this has been a bigger topic over the past 3 to 4 years where people are moving into away from this idea that you can just have one really great optimized page and that you really need kind of a network of pages that cover a topic exhaustively.

 

00:13:23:21 – 00:13:51:16

Patrick Carver

Because as Google comes and looks at your website and if they’re comparing two sites, one has one page about a topic and then the other has five or 10 to 5 and ten is really going to look much more like an expert, right? They’re going to have a much bigger depth of information on this topic. And so often they will kind of get that nod as the better selection or better choice for position in the search results.

 

00:13:51:18 – 00:14:20:15

Patrick Carver

So let’s move on to strategy. Now that we have gone through this analysis process, We’ve we’ve looked at a bunch of different things. We have to start coming up with our conclusions. Right? And this is always a challenging part of the equation because it’s so subjective, right? Like we have the ability to look at some factors like the meta, other things that are objectively across the board we know is a best practice right?

 

00:14:20:15 – 00:14:42:27

Patrick Carver

So Google will give you some insight as to what they’re looking for in their algorithm or how they weight different things. And so we we seize those opportunities, right? Anything that they are going to give us, we’re going to take advantage of and and go and adopt those because it’s a stated thing that kind of meets their goals.

 

00:14:42:27 – 00:15:04:22

Patrick Carver

And, you know, a good example of this is this page speed, right? This is not a secret. They want you to have a fast website that can be viewed on a mobile device and it can be viewed equally well whether you have dial up Internet or the fastest broadband in the world. And the reason for that is go back to their basic goals, right?

 

00:15:04:29 – 00:15:24:28

Patrick Carver

They want more people on their platform. They want people to get answers quickly and get the best answer possible so that they’ll keep using Google and see it as a reliable source of information. And so it’s in Google’s best interest to make sure that all of the pages they feature are going to load quickly, are going to be accessible.

 

00:15:24:28 – 00:15:46:23

Patrick Carver

They look good on mobile devices, all of that stuff, so that they can improve their market share. It’s as simple as that. And so when they tell us things like that, we want to seize those opportunities, right? And so we do a lot of optimization work on the on the speed side, on the, you know, the content side, the technical side behind the scenes, the coding, the media, all of that stuff.

 

00:15:46:23 – 00:16:09:20

Patrick Carver

And so, you know, when people talk about, oh, you know, they’ll say something like, well, I just I know you guys are going to get the right, put the need to put the right keywords on there. And yeah, that’s that’s kind of true. But there’s, there’s so many other elements that go in here and it’s it’s really a, I believe, a confluence of all of those factors that then go into who ultimately is going to rank.

 

00:16:09:20 – 00:16:29:21

Patrick Carver

It’s not one thing or the other. Some have a bigger weight of of the algorithm, but ultimately you want to be taking care of all of this stuff. So when we get into a situation like this and we’re looking at a page and trying to make it rank, we need to determine do we are we going to do an evolution or revolution?

 

00:16:29:23 – 00:16:53:11

Patrick Carver

Right? And the difference here is that with an evolution, we’re talking about adjustment. We’re tweaking, making small tweaks, doing little things right, but we’re not going to just throw the page completely out. We would do this in a scenario where we know that the page is ranking at some level. So maybe it’s on the second page of Google, maybe they were on the first page and dropped off.

 

00:16:53:13 – 00:17:20:20

Patrick Carver

That’s a perfect situation where we would go evolution, right? Because it’s clearly we’re getting some feedback from Google that this is, you know, up there, it’s close, it has value, but something’s off. Something is not is keeping us from being that that first page result and being the top choice by Google. So that’s what really the analysis part is all about is figuring out that that qualitative difference between us and the people that are ranking revolution is going to be a little bit different, right?

 

00:17:20:26 – 00:17:42:26

Patrick Carver

So this is a situation where you put up a page and maybe you’ve optimized it a couple of times and you still are on page four, page five or something like that where you’re really just not getting into the top level page. And so when that happens and it you’ve had you’ve given it enough time, you know, between three six months some are you can even go more.

 

00:17:42:26 – 00:18:00:02

Patrick Carver

But I think in that that span of time you’re going to be able to tell if it gets up to the second page or third page, you’re going to you’re going to kind of know that it is progressing, but something’s a little bit wrong with it. But if it stays in those deeper levels, you’re going to know something’s definitely wrong with that page.

 

00:18:00:02 – 00:18:26:05

Patrick Carver

And usually it comes down to user intent, right? So with a keyword like immigration lawyer San Diego, the user intent is most likely going to be someone looking for a lawyer. Now, if you were a let’s say a a a company that publishes job wage descriptions, right, you might want to create a page called Immigration Lawyer San Diego.

 

00:18:26:07 – 00:18:50:00

Patrick Carver

What do you what will you make what is the pay rate for this? That’s a very different user intent than someone searching for a lawyer. And so you have to be aware of that. And if Google has decided that the majority of people are looking for a lawyer because they need to they need their service, then they’re not going to elevate these other pages that talk about the wages because it’s a completely different user, a completely different type of person out there.

 

00:18:50:00 – 00:19:10:06

Patrick Carver

So if you have one of those misalignments, that’s when you would want to do a new page. We also are going to look at all of those pieces of analysis that we looked at and then pick what we’re going to do as far as an optimization implementation, right? So we will sometimes do some of them will focus more on length, sometimes we’ll focus more on content.

 

00:19:10:13 – 00:19:31:15

Patrick Carver

It really comes down to what we see in those in those reports. This is where it is really subjective. That’s where you get people who can make those calls and really can do a good job of analyzing and then executing on those on those items right. The final piece of this is then you want to track the performance of those improvements.

 

00:19:31:15 – 00:19:53:06

Patrick Carver

So very kind of simple way to do this that I feel is the best is going to be using your calendar. Okay. So making the change on a page and even if you are not a technical person or like don’t have SEO training or anything, you can still do this analysis, right? You can still go without any tool.

 

00:19:53:09 – 00:20:12:10

Patrick Carver

Look at your page and then look at the top three results, Right? What do they have in common? Get out this paper on one. What do they have in common? And then go look at your patience. See what? What doesn’t match up. Right. They’ve got more pictures. They’ve got the articles are way longer. You can get a good assessment just based on on that.

 

00:20:12:10 – 00:20:34:14

Patrick Carver

Right. And so once you then go in and make that change, you go right, a couple extra paragraphs, you see a couple of of topics that they covered that you did not cover and go do that. Go set a an event on your calendar to go look at the page in like two weeks or a month. And that gives Google enough time to crawl the website again and then hopefully reposition it higher up in the in the search results.

 

00:20:34:14 – 00:21:02:03

Patrick Carver

And that’s the best way to do it, because then you’ll know very, very black and white whether or not the, you know, the changes had an impact. Right? So when you’re going through all this analysis, it’s really easy to get caught in analysis paralysis. But the thing I want to encourage you to do is go in and pick one thing, right, pick the content, pick increased images, things like that, and just go for it.

 

00:21:02:03 – 00:21:26:02

Patrick Carver

You don’t it doesn’t need to be perfect when you make these changes because it’s always going to be this iterative process because the results are going to change daily. So you kind of have to be on your toes and basically watching it, maintaining it, making those tweaks whenever you need to, but you don’t want to just do it once and then think that that’s going to that’s going to solve it for for the long term.

 

00:21:26:02 – 00:21:52:17

Patrick Carver

If you have not obtained those those good positions that you are actively after. Cool. So that’s the majority of it. But I’m going to go through just a couple of kind of wise to keep in mind when when doing this optimization process. So the first thing is a reduction in traffic is not always a bad thing. What I mean by this is that there’s scenarios where you’re going to see a reduction in your traffic.

 

00:21:52:19 – 00:22:21:07

Patrick Carver

Not always a bad thing, right? So it’s a very common scenario that we get with clients coming to us is we will start analyzing their website and it looks like they have a lot of traffic, yet they’re saying, I’m not getting any leads. The leads are bad quality. People are calling me for things I don’t do. Stuff like that usually the the the the thing that is a problem there is that they have been able to obtain traffic, but it’s not the right traffic.

 

00:22:21:07 – 00:22:45:10

Patrick Carver

So often what happens here is an SEO team will come in, they’ll go after keywords that are higher volume but extremely low difficulty. And so you put a page up about something like what to wear to court or what what’s the best suit brand to wear to court that doesn’t really help you so much in terms of new business development, new client acquisition.

 

00:22:45:12 – 00:23:09:18

Patrick Carver

There’s maybe some, some benefit there for from a supporting content, but these these things can happen where it just kind of takes off because for some reason, maybe you’re one of the only people who wrote that article or whatever, and you kind of bought into this, you know, the search trend of people doing it. And so you get all this traffic, but it’s not good traffic.

 

00:23:09:18 – 00:23:34:06

Patrick Carver

It’s not people coming because they need your service. And so sometimes when we are going to go in and do a big optimization temporarily, that traffic will decline. But that’s actually not a bad thing, right? Because we’re filtering out for people who are just the non, you know, don’t have any intent of actually hiring you. And so just having that traffic, not always a great thing.

 

00:23:34:08 – 00:23:55:08

Patrick Carver

Also, keep in mind that the algorithm changes a little bit every day and then a couple big ones each year. Those are called core updates. And so, you know, there’s this kind of idea, I think from a long time ago that, you know, you just kind of pop in the keywords and it’s going to be it’s going to be good or, you know, Google changes their algorithm once in a while or once every couple of years.

 

00:23:55:08 – 00:24:23:01

Patrick Carver

And, you know, you kind of have to react to it. But it’s really an everyday type of thing. They’re tweaking every single day different components. And then during those big core updates, that’s when you see these big, big shifts. And if you have a good SEO company, they’re studying that, they’re analyzing it, they’re seeing what’s happened to your performance, and then they’re doing fresh optimization so that if other people have been elevated or you’ve been a devalued in the search results, you can go in and see, okay, what what are they valuing now?

 

00:24:23:01 – 00:24:44:23

Patrick Carver

What’s common between these people who have elevated and how can we implement that in our page? Also, don’t freak out if there is a drop I would like in this to the stock market. Right. So everybody here most likely invest in in the stock market. And what do they tell you about stock market is you make money from holding.

 

00:24:44:23 – 00:25:10:09

Patrick Carver

Right. Don’t get into trying to picks, pick winners and ride winner stocks and losers and stuff like that when they’ve looked and done data analysis between putting your money in just like a regular S&P 500 fund, an index fund versus a managed fund from the hedge fund type people or private wealth managers, the basic S&P almost always wins, right?

 

00:25:10:11 – 00:25:39:19

Patrick Carver

And over the last 40 years, there’s always between 7 to 10% growth. This is the exact same thing with SEO, right? You are going to see some drops and high bounce backs along the way. And if you really just focus on those two core elements of Google algorithm, you’re going to be in great shape, content and links. So putting out really good content, well-researched, helpful type content that covers everything and putting out a lot of comments on your website.

 

00:25:39:19 – 00:26:03:01

Patrick Carver

So you’re real authority with what you’re talking about. And then the link building, are you getting added to these other websites? Are you in a lot of features from a lot of other domains? Those are the two core things that have always remained the same from Google, and I don’t anticipate them going anywhere soon. And then finally, the the other metaphor, I’ll just throw this in there for for kicks is it’s farming as well.

 

00:26:03:01 – 00:26:26:01

Patrick Carver

So I think the way I think about SEO is a little bit like farming in the sense that, you know, you can go and get your groceries at the store. That’s more of like advertising for me where you know you’re going to get the quick resolution. You’re but you’re going have to pay a premium. So with ads, we can start you on a campaign and get you running in seven or 14 days.

 

00:26:26:03 – 00:26:48:13

Patrick Carver

But with farming, it’s definitely more of a long term investment, right, Or growing your own your own food at home. Right. It’s more challenging. There’s there’s more elements that can go wrong. It takes more more time, more energy. There is some risk associated with it. But if you have been trained well and you have a good team behind you, those risks are significantly lower, right?

 

00:26:48:13 – 00:27:05:24

Patrick Carver

And you have a much better chance of succeeding. And then we think in the long term, you really get the benefit of this, right? So you are going to get lower cost per lead. You’re going to get much, many more leads than than really ads can ever compete with. Unless you’re just spending an astronomical amount, ad costs continue to go up.

 

00:27:05:27 – 00:27:26:16

Patrick Carver

They’re getting crazy for four practice areas like criminal estate planning, not just pie anymore. And so you’re really building this foundation for your own lead pipe. Once you can, you can control your real estate and have this asset in the long term for no matter what you want to do with your practice, you just want to keep and run, keep getting leads that are not just referrals.

 

00:27:26:21 – 00:27:51:19

Patrick Carver

Great option. Or if you ever plan on selling, you have a legitimate asset that is turning out leads for you and helping with you. So remember a couple key things on this. Keep iterating, keep focused on keeping doing your optimizations over and over again through time. Make sure to track them, get that feedback from Google and don’t get don’t get down or don’t get worried.

 

00:27:51:19 – 00:28:05:07

Patrick Carver

If you do, if you are seeing drops and things like that, you always have the opportunity to recover. It’s a very dynamic environment. So with all of that, I think I’ll I’ll close this and wish you nothing but success with your optimizations.

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